He Built a Nonprofit at 18. Now He's Building the Future of AI.

you start to realize that that art of creation is actually to me it's kind of the essence of being alive and and when we talk about what's the purpose of humanity in the age of AI I think it's the art of creation that art of creation is what got me to where I'm at nonprofit you know and helping change legislation across the country Hi everyone, my name is Carmen Dovid and I will be hosting today's episode of Behind the Founders. And here I am interviewing Tyler Ridi. Hey Tyler, welcome. >> Hey, great to to be here. Yeah, thanks.

>> Glad to have you on as well. So Tyler, to get us started, could you introduce yourself to the listeners out there? >> Yeah. Well, hey, Tyler here, founder of Volumes. Yeah, we do spatial data for physical AI and robotics. Yeah, I mean a little bit of background on me. I'll start with the professional side, go into personal. We can dive deeper too. Uh on the professional side, yeah, I had a long and winding career. Uh you know, everything from you know, of course founding a startup before that in management uh consulting do a lot lot of autonomous solutions. Before that, founded a nonprofit organization to alleviate the opioid crisis in New York State. Before that, ran for elected office. Uh did did a lot of interesting things along along the way.

uh more personally through that journey. It was sort of like you know discovering my uh self in the process and falling in love with the nature of building. You know everything that threaded together a very unconventional and seemingly like unconnected path was actually this passion for wanting to build things and wanting to make the world a better place. And in everything that I did, although it was not connected, it was sort of trying to get to that broader, you know, north star trajectory and go into more of that. But yeah, that's that's the gist of it.

>> Okay. Yeah, I mean, I had the chance to take a look at your LinkedIn profile and you definitely have a very rich, very diverse experiences. You know, I see as you mentioned, you worked in government, politics, nonprofits. You were also working in consulting in Deote as well. So I guess I'm curious to know >> what made you decide to go from Deote to finding or being a founder a recent founder of volumes. >> Yeah. Well, consulting is an interesting career, right? It's great when you're out of out of college and I think it's a great leapfrog job. It's a great job for the generalist. effectively a generous consultants able to do multiple verticals and within each vertical you're able to touch use cases that you otherwise wouldn't get get to touch you're able to interact with executives you wouldn't really get to interact with and with that experience that was sort of my like thesis in going into

consulting postgrad it was okay well in the short period of time postgrad out of undergrad you know how do I get how do I maximize my few years to get the most amount of experience experiences in most amount of verticals as I possibly can for whatever I want to do do next. uh this is you know coming right out of you know 2021 covid starting in consulting thesis didn't really play out exactly how I imagined it too you know I entered consulting at my first consulting firm that I was at and immediately was doing work from from home implementation work was actually you know be honest quite boring work uh it was very very boring very very it was not not fulfilling you know >> uh compared to what I was doing beforehand which was you know I founded a 51c3 nonprofit profit organization to alleviate the opioid crisis in New York State. We helped you know the short of it is we helped get Nllaxone opioid

reversal drug into all public school districts across New York State. That was sort of my claim to fame when I was 18 year years old. >> Okay. >> And it was a moment where you know I realized okay you know I can create things. I can build things and you know plant this seed for something to grow that's beyond myself. You know, it's a really interesting feeling when you can actually plant the seed and actually watch something blossom that becomes bigger than you. It's kind of an entity, an entity that takes form and then when that ecosystem builds up and up and up and more people join it, it becomes collective effort and a movement and effect grassroots mo movement that took shape that then turned into like a political campaign platform. When I was 18 years old, I was one of the uh youngest candidates to ever run in in New York State to run for elected office. I like to joke.

>> Okay. >> Yeah. I like to joke that, you know, I'm a hockey person in many ways and it's evident because the first person that I voted for was myself. So, >> okay. >> I know, you know. So, when it comes to then going back to your question, just to pivot back to it is, you know, why volumes? Why did I go and you know did that career in in the very classic traditionalist career in consulting to then take most unconventional path which is entrepreneurship. It was because I'm cocky enough to think that I can change the world and I love the status quo go against the grain and be as quirky as possible because in that journey uh as you're you know creating things you you have the opportunity to to maximize the impact you have on on others. And so for volumes the impact that we're doing is you know we're making AI safe we're making AI better we're making they hallucinate less and actually make AI

work in the real world so it works for us works better and I also think and we can talk about this in a second you know is the whole idea of you know AI right now you're either a participant or a spectator in what's happening in the AI and as I enter that arena enter that that ring you know I want to be a particip in shaping that that future for for for the better and have that voice. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, for sure. I wanted to follow up on when you mentioned that you want to make AI more safe. So, could you elaborate a little bit more? Is it basically doing some I don't know validation in terms of I don't know let's say chatbt Gemini claude or are you also developing newer AI tools for people to use for people to have access to make it safe just so that you know the listeners out there can get a better understanding because I think you know to hear that of course it's definitely a little bit comforting

reassuring because I think there's a lot of people who are I would say even part of the resistance group of AI because they're like oh maybe there's invasion of privacy you upload a lot of pictures you upload this and that they're going to collect all the information. So how do you ensure that the AI is safe? >> Yeah. Yeah. So it's really tough, right? And so first on the first part of the question like what type of model like what are we talking about here when we talk about a AI? All right. So there's a classic LLM chatbot. We're moving beyond the chatbot. It's also known as the LLM.

uh these are large language models and that's taking a shape as Claude as Gemini as ChiBT as Gro etc. But then there's this like new form emerging right basically AI is going from digital to physical and as it goes to physical that means that it's going from say like a computer vision a computer screen out into the real world and what does that actually mean right so you know it's taking the shape not as an LLM but as what they call this like new model is called a world model and this world model actually operates less like predicting the next word in a text, you know, like, you know, a text prediction, uh, you know, writing as a as a chatbot, but instead it's predicting the next action. It's predicting the next action and it's connecting a word to that action as it as it can actually perceive as it actually has sight and it's getting very very close because effectively when we take a step back, I

mean, what is AI? It's not a chatbot. It's actually a thinking machine. And this is the most grounding and most sobering thing that we need to realize. It's that we've and it's been this journey for thousands of years since the the Greeks and the Romans and the Egyptians have been thinking about this idea and and you look back at philosophy back then. It's the nature of learning. And we've effectively mechanized a form of learning. We've created an architecture that knows how to learn. And when you give it enough data and enough compute power, electricity and such, and then you have the model in place, those three things, compute, data, and model, that enables this learning mechanism that we've created a mechanized form to learn. And that's incredible. So we tested it on text. We gave it a bunch of text, Moby, Dick, all of basically the whole every, you know, centuries of human text. We gave it

every bit of centuries of human text. And that's how we get the chachi BT. Then we gave it billions of hours of YouTube video and billions of images on Getty images and tons and tons of of data. And then we're able to get to VO and Sora. Um, and many other image and video diffusion models. Um, >> and then now we're getting to a point where it's now becoming physical. But the issue here is that you know so that's taking the form as like as robotics as ambient AI uh basically anything that's a machine that's a techn you know anything that's tech will eventually become an an yeah learning system the issue here though is there's not enough data there's not an internet scale corpus of human behavior of real world data to train on you if you if you give Moby Dick you know that that text to a physical AI okay it understands the book but it doesn't understand how the world actually works. So what we're

doing is we're creating data that actually helps to understand how the world works and how it should behave safely in in the world. So because if you just let a robot go rogue, I mean that actually is not a sci-fi thing. It's a very very real thing and imaginate to imagine the Star Trek future an optimistic you know Gene Rodenberry future of the world than say like a Terminator version of right uh we've been talking about this for a while 2001 a space odyssey laid it out you know the power of dual use with AI and it's very important in the way that we train these models and the data that we give it that we train it in the right way that's a safe way and that's something that I'm really really focus focused on on doing right. So yeah, I I'll pause there. There's a lot to break break down there.

>> Yeah. Yeah. No, definitely. I can I can definitely see that. You know, you're really passionate about leading this impact and ensuring also that like you said that, you know, with those tools of AI, it is in a way sometimes I like to compare it as an intern, you're training them to learn and also like I would say validate like the accuracy of the information that is being shared to the world, right? because it is so I think nowadays a lot of people they do there are some tendencies to rely on AI because it is very you know it's efficient it's fast and one thing that came to my mind actually was this movie I don't know if you've recently seen it it's called no mercy >> no no I I haven't >> yeah so >> yeah you should definitely check out it's very intense but basically what this movie is about is there's this movement where they are basically implementing AI as the jury to see okay

if this person is innocent or not and then there was a cop he was supporting the movement but for some reason he was accused of killing his own wife and he has to prove his innocence in front of AI that he didn't do it so it was very intense but in a way also goes to show that you know what like AI can help so much but you know it is still not perfect as well so that just really got me thinking but yeah definitely check out that movie Well, Carmen, I mean, ask yourself, is that a world that we even want to have an AI jury? you know, and >> the principles of democracy of having a a human jury and all the the the ultihuman error that comes with a human jury that being baked into our our constitution in the US, you know, baked into the to the constitution, you know, to have in the, you know, how infallible humans are, but still recognizing that there is some sort of truth to come from

not some very objective surveillance state, not some you know government or some king, some king say you know you are at fault but people ordinary people like the person being judged like the person on the stand is that actually a world that we want to have AI doing that you know sure it probably more accurate but it's also removed of of humanity in many ways we look for concrete examples of this happening right now China is deploying uh surveillance AI on it on its citizens where it's actually taking in data and uh it's taking in all the social media data on the citizens and building a citizen profile on you. So for me, if I was in China, if I was a citizen of China, it would have, okay, Tyler is a founder of volumes. He watches on, you know, these types of videos, those videos from the metadata means he likes X, Y, and Z. He likes to paint. I'm making this up. He likes to paint. Yeah.

>> He likes photography, which I actually do. He likes, you know, 2001 Space Odyssey and Stanley Kubric, you know, which I actually do. Uh, and then it'll have a profile of me and different things. And you know, if he typically travels to, you know, Trader Joe's to pick up some, you know, I don't know, almond milk, >> it's all your data. >> And it'll have my grocery list. And I mean, I don't actually know what's in the black box, so I'm kind of making this up. But it'll have a profile and metadata on who I am and what I do and what I like and what it's and and what this these surveillance systems are trying to do is then predict, okay, what's the likelihood that I will do X.

It's a prediction system. And it's meant to be proactive and know before I know what I'm going to do, the state would know what I'm going to do. And we're more predictable than we think. We say the same things. We do the same things over and over again. We pattern recognition is part of human existence. And the one thing that AI is really good at is pattern recognition. So that's a big concern when you give AI to to the state. So So making sure that we're very very careful about that. It's something that I'm, you know, super wary of, uh, especially as AI gets to AGI, a generalized intelligence, which it is approaching. And, and, you know, people have different definitions of what that actually means to be clear. And I think that there's an issue in how a lot of entrepreneurs have pronounced a AGI to be coming and what that would mean as derivative effects. You know, people talk about job loss and we don't know

actually what's going to happen. Now the CEOs are from the frontier labs are walking some of that back. Some of them are walking it more forward. The truth is and I think I think Demis from Google uh Deep Mind he says it really really well that we really don't know what's happening. What we do know is that we're in a singularity with where if you believe in Moore's law Moore's law means that technology doubles upon itself every two years. We're at the point where of that exponential where it's starting to go vertical because it's for humans to imagine an exponential. Most people imagine technology getting linearly progressively better over time as a straight curve as a straight line.

But to imagine a curve, a curve implies that at some point technology just takes off. >> Yeah. >> I think we're in that moment of takeoff. And that is is really really hard because it's it's hard to imagine if I asked you Carmen like what does AI actually look like when it if it were to double upon itself right now? What would that even mean? Like to imagine it being double the intelligence of what it is now. How how can we even fathom that? Because that would probably imply it's basically at our intelligence now more or less. It's jagged in in you know the intelligence sort of jagged. It's good at some things, kind of very dumb at other things, but eventually it'll kind of level off and it'll be intelligent at everything, and then it'll actually be super intelligent at at specific things.

Uh, and what does that actually mean in the long run? >> Uh, and then and then what's the humanity? Where does humanity come in? And, you know, what do we do? You know, where do we kind of exist in that super intelligent world? And I think that that's why the data that we train it on, right? because we can control all that. People say, "Oh, you can't control AI." You actually can. You can control the data it's trained on. Because, you know, it's not that this is inevitably occurring. It's only inevitably incurring because people are building it. But it's depending on how you build the architecture, what data you you feed it, and how the the compute power that you're you're giving it. We can stop the amount of compute power. At a certain point, we can stop maybe not innovating.

AI will start to innovate upon itself and make its architecture better, you know, so the model will consistently be optimized better and better, but we can certainly slow down on data. We can certainly slow down on compute power uh if we're ever worried. And I think regulation is a very important thing in robotics because robotics can be very dual use. You can have robots in your home, you know, doing laundry for you, making >> Oh, yeah. >> you a [ __ ] >> Yeah, it's happening in China. I was at something called the humanoid summit in Tokyo. That's a real thing. I was literally imagine. It's crazy to even say I was at a humanoid summit and that's like a real like summit. People are coming to that and I went to it to see, you know, I was like just curious like what is going on here and it's it's right it was right in front of me. I mean these humanoids are like walking around and they are real. They are it's

not sci-fi. It's not a futuristic thing. It's actually very current state. And the future state thing we got to be thinking about is how do we how does this actually benefit us? And that's something that I'm working on. >> Yeah. I do want to say though, I love what you emphasize about that, you know, we still have human control when it comes to how much data we want to give away or to train for the AI and so on. And that kind of leads me to my next question in terms of your current business with volumes, right? It is fairly new. You started at the beginning of this year. Do you have a team of people who are supporting you in terms of developing all those algorithms, the prediction, the machine learning and so on? How does your team setup look like?

>> Yeah. Yeah, it's a great great team. My co-founder likes to call it the Avengers team. I think it's a super, you know, hustling team with great morals. In fact, when we Yeah. When we first met, I remember I got back from Italy and the Pompei ruins in, you know, near, you know, in Rome, near near Italy, sorry. You know, the Pompei ruins were such an interesting thing to to view because you see a whole civilization that was that was there and you get to see like the bread that they were baking, you know, in what was it 79 CE, right? I mean, 2,000 years ago. And you get to like see like like literally the bread who is like literally there that they baked on that day when the volcano erupted. You get to see their the fabric and walk through the homes. I bring this up because it it made me feel the fragility of humanity and the importance of civilization and how um how their you know how they

how they lived 2,000 years ago is no different than how people live now. You know, the bread they they baked then is the bread that we bake now. and they had the same thoughts that we have. Uh only a volcano erupted and you know took out that that Roman town. I bring that up because, you know, when I came back to the US, I knew that, you know, the moment that we're in, like I said, we're either a spectator or a participant. in this moment of chaos. Extremely important moment for humanity. And I needed to be a part of this to be able to shape this in a way and not just be on the sidelines watching people who some of some people I'm not going to name but some people who I don't really trust, you know, do things that are unsafe, you know, especially as we enter into physical AI from digital to physical. And and so I then went on a yapping tour. As you can see, I can yap for a while. And so I went on that

yapping tour with uh to a bunch of different events and I bumped into one guy who yapped even more than me and his name was Ch. >> A yapping contest. >> Yeah. We we then we yapped off and and so and in that yapping we found this convergence of ideas. I knew the problem of AI which is what I'm expressing this thing about data. there was not there wasn't any internet scale corpus of physical AI data and people were creating it but in ways that I didn't think was a good approach and then I met Shet you know he just graduated from Harvard and he was working multimodal data he was also like I don't like how people are doing it over in his multimmodal data I want to go and do my own thing he went on his own wandering journey and he kind of wandered to me and I wandered to him and I had the problem he had a solution. he worked in, you know, he grew up, you know, he's a Hollywood kid, uh, grew up on Hollywood

sets, and he thought, well, we can capture, >> uh, if we can almost build like a movie studio, you know, as a company, you know, Tyler, then actually were able to to create capture the ground truth and actually have AI almost like touch grass in a way by capturing super highfidelity data, you know, just to get into the tech technical bit, the the the tech of it in a very like high way. Right now, physical AI is hallucinating how the world works, which makes it not safe, you know? So, it wouldn't actually understand like if I put my phone up, you can kind of guess how far away it is from my from my camera, but you don't actually know. You're gonna you're approximating it because why? It's a moninocular 2D. It's two-dimensional X and Y. It's pixel. So, what you actually need, and it's how we see when we're in real life.

If you saw me in real life, you'd have a much better idea of that because then we're in 3D. We're in person. And then there's not just X and Y and 2D. It's actually three-dimensional because we have Z. We have said, which is that third dimension being depth. And we're don't just live in a 3D world. We live in a 4D world. That fourth dimension being time. Because we're in a 3D world moving through time. You would see me in real life as I as we all move through that linear time. And that's the data that you need to train physical AI on X Y Z and T not just you know video because then it's hallucinating things that that would mean in the practical world if it picks up a wine glass it might just shatter as it you know as a robot moves its hand towards a wine wine glass or you know if there if it's going to like cut a carrot and it's picking up a knife. I mean it's it's a dangerous thing. a more practical example of

physical AI. The Whimos driving around in in in San Fran, in LA, in you know, in Vegas, they're coming to New York, but New York is not allowing them. You know, my city here is not allowing the Whimos to come. Why is that? That's because they right now are driving past school buses and they don't actually recognize the whimos can't recognize that that a school bus sign when it pops out from the school bus to to stop the car and wait for the kids to pass. Imagine it's it's crazy to think that a human driver can only that a human driver in their lifetime drives around 400,000 miles and a whimo drive 1 million miles. per day. per day.

>> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> That's an acceleration. Yeah. >> Yeah. But but the human driver still knows the stop for the school bus and the Whimos don't. So even with all that training data, that 1 million hours per day, sorry, one one million miles per per day in training data, the Whimos still don't know to stop and to protect kids. And that's what I mean that it's not safe. Even with all that data, it's the wrong data training on. >> Absolutely. For sure. And like coming back to like your teams, so like how many of you are currently in in volumes?

How many of you are working together and what are the challenges that you are currently facing? >> Yeah. Yeah. Right now, yeah. So, it's a it's a nimble team. You know, in the AI era, you don't need a big team. Uh it's myself, uh my my co-founder Chad I told you about. Uh and then there's Ed, our our coder. You know, he's coding right now, ulting for the rest of the night. And we have others in the periphery. It's an ecosystem that that we've built. The ecosystem that we've we've built. There's a lot of folks. We have interns coming in uh too many to count and uh you know PhDs you know contract with us from Bell Labs to other you know major organizations. We have investors we have the the mentors we have customers. We have partners and it's really just amazing you know how quickly >> consider it all one big team when you really when you look at it because even the founders us three you know and we're

raising now we'll have an even bigger full-time team you know in the next few few months we're already venturebacked and we're going to be we have a significant raise coming up too >> and and it's really fascinating to uh to see though even beyond our our nimble agile team with the agents deployed and all and all that. I mean, it's great to see, you know, the breath of everyone around you in the periphery that actually gets point, you know, so I'd be like remiss to not, you know, mention them. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's always just going back to what you mentioned. It's like you're kind of seeing the the bread that you've been baking. It's it's coming to life and it's >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

>> All the people from the team as well. >> Yeah. Tyler, I'm actually really curious to learn a little bit more about your experience. Um because you said I know I'm jumping back and forth but I'm just genuinely curious about your like I would say like you know what what's like your driving force because you know you've had so many diverse you were working in so many diverse different types of organizations industries and you founded a nonprofit just at the age of 18 specifically something that's really really like heavy I would say um yeah really really heavy like a really heavy and serious cause which is related to the overdose reduction group. So, could you tell us a little bit about the story behind that?

>> Yeah, I I like I like the heavy stuff. AI opio deep. >> Yes. Let's dive into it. Let's go deep. >> Yeah. So, it helps. But to explain all that, it helps to actually go back, you know, to my childhood. Like, I grew up, you know, honestly, you know, to be totally frank, you know, below below the poverty line, moving home to home every year. Um and I I lived with my dad growing up and you know he was a very entrepreneurial person. uh but you know job stability, financial security those are things that I struggled with and you know by you know default I was also struggling with them you know growing up you know without food moving home to home you know not having any money you know so that you know informed me informed the way in which I operate in in the real world and I had to kind of get mature quick and be serious about what I'm doing and there were like three things that I learned very very quickly

one, you have to create a platform for yourself to stand on, you know. So back when I was a kid, you know, I was just, you know, Tyler the kid, you know, that didn't really have a path forward, you know, was struggling in school, you know, because, you know, I was kind of giving up and but, you know, and anxious and depressed and um, you know, it was just I was falling into the cycle that, you know, many kids do, uh, when they're in those, you know, in that like impoverished, you know, kind of, you know, situation. But you know I was able to create you know by creating like a nonprofit for example you know I was able to actually and I created that nonprofit because there was an overdose in my school in my in my high school and it was a friend who you know overdosed on an opioid >> and you know but there was no nlloxxone that opioid reversal drug there was no nlloxxone in that school so and I was

wondering why is there no nlloxxone it's only $20 and it's a little like nasal spray Right. And it brings a person back to life. It's the only drug that'll >> okay to help you recover from the drug overdose. Okay. Got it. >> It's actually like a life saving drug. It's the only thing that reverse the overdose otherwise will die. >> Okay? >> You know, otherwise a person dies. And so I wondered why would that life-saving drug that cost $20 and as simple as a nasal spray in the nose, why would that not be matt mandated or in like because basically the you know there wasn't Narcan on site and it made no sense to me. So I then made a whole movement around that after what happened, you know, >> the fact that that, you know, how could a student a student suffer, you know, from such a silly mistake, yet there's a CPR kit and an AED kit that's mandated in every school district. Um, so I sort

of made it like a mission to, okay, let me go out and, you know, change the legislation. And then through that effort I built an ecosystem around that you know and then I'll and then getting back to those like three points you know one point that I realized in doing that is one by creating a platform to stand on I lifted myself up while I lifted others up because then I became Tyler the executive director of a nonprofit organization making community. >> I was no longer Tyler the kid with you know >> the kid.

>> Yeah. Tyler that was floundering you know uh and didn't really have anything to say. Now I had a mission statement I had a vision I had an organization and people around me ecosystem and alliance cultivation. I also learned the power of that ecosystem. You know building people around you the thing that you create becomes bigger than you and it's it's never about me. Ideally whatever I create it takes on a life of its own. Simone de Borvoir, the philosopher, French philosopher says uh you know female philosopher too says uh the art the the purpose of life is the art of creation and you know in a similar fashion Voltater in can candid you know says also another French philosopher I guess I have like a knack for that but but in Candid says you know one must cultivate our own garden and so you know you start to realize that that art of creation is actually to me it's kind of the essence of being alive and and and

the purpose of one's life, you know, is to build things. It's to create things and it's to bring to thrust ideas from our head into the world. And when we talk about what's the purpose of humanity in the age of AI, I think it's the art of creation. I think it's the art of creation. So, but that art of creation is what got me to where I'm at. It's what created a very unconventional career from, you know, being, you know, a kid below the poverty line, moving home to home with nothing to then creating a nonprofit, you know, and helping change legislation across, you know, the the the country. Uh, we got many bills passed. We changed the legislation in New York State. We had our bill passed. Uh, we had the law then changed in LA County shortly after.

other states have looked at the legislation that we put forward and they've copied candidate around the country in in the US and then that got me you know the tailwinds of that got me to run for elected office be the youngest candidate to run ever in New York state in when when I ran and then I kept on going through that art of creation that art of building and and and putting things into the world going you know zero to one and that's then led me to now do the next you know again heavy thing and it's all been it's all been you So I like the consequential things and that's led me to AI which I think is one of the most consequential moments in humanity and getting it right doing it right is the most important thing bigger than myself putting it into the world and making sure that you know there's a north star that I'm following too.

>> So you know that's how that's kind of the method to the matt the matting approach. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, honestly like the the use of imagery that you were just using it's it's really beautifully said and summed up. You know, at the end of the day, right, I think really the driving force is seeing that, you know, the world is really big out there. The world is so much bigger than what we perceive to be. And for you to just mention, you know, like for an example, the the spray that you mentioned to help with the the recovery, you know, from the overdose, it's like sometimes it's like, yeah, the world is really big, but even like every small little action does count and can have like a ripple effect and can make a difference as well. And I think it's really honestly like really inspiring to see that all of the initiatives that you've taken on has really, you know, you've been reaping what you're sewing

and you've definitely left an impact. I mean, at the end of the day, everything points to impact and everything like that. >> Yeah, I try. That's the goal. That's the north star. It's to maximize, more specifically, is to maximize the impact that I can have in the world. And ideally when I go zero to one, when I not not to be too Peter Teal, but when I go zero to one, when I cultivate my own garden, when I practice that art of creation, as Borvoir and as you know, Volt and others would say, you know, that we're creating a world that, you know, is, you know, at the end of it better, you know. So that's that I try to that that art of creation and that essence of impact that threads together every bit of what I do every day. Mhm.

Yeah. In a way, it's kind of like art, architect, designing and things like that that bring eventually bring the ideas to life as well. Tyler, so just one final question and I think this is something that will be very, I would say, relevant, insightful for people who are considering to start a cause, start a movement, start a new business. I can imagine a lot of people are they're probably overthinking. They're probably, you know, having a lot of doubts and so on. If you could pass on a message, what would it be? >> Sure. Yeah. People can ideate and ideate all they want, but you have to go from passive to active. You will always be passive and you will always be in ideiation mode until you yourself actually decides to go active, decides to take the plunge and honestly decides to hit well. And what I like to say is, you know, having a person, you know, hit what I like to call the the [ __ ] it

button. And the hit the [ __ ] it button. Hitting the [ __ ] it button means saying [ __ ] it and just taking the the the the plunge effectively and plunging into whatever idea you have. I could have ideiated on this forever and I did not have it all figured out. Today I don't have it all figured out. In fact, no one even no one no matter what pundant on TV, no matter what YouTube video or what podcast, including me, I don't know half of what I'm saying. Most people know nothing of what they're saying. I'm judging it on the signals that I see at the frontier from the researchers and trying to be as objective as I can about it. And from that objectivity deriving signals that I think are, you know, predict could predict, you know, alternative possibilities on where things go. But the truth of it is I don't know and no one knows. But we do know that AI is going is going to be one of the most consequential technologies

to ever exist. You're either a spectator or a participant. And right now the moment to go from passive to active to activate whatever ideiating thing you have bubbling up in your head. Do you really want to do the moment to do that thing is right now? There has never been a single a better moment to go out and to create. Final thing, we're entering into the owner's economy where equity over salary is one of the best forms of of I think operating because we don't know you know exactly again we don't know like where what AI renders you know jobs everyone's very worried about jobs well if people are so worried for anyone so worried about a job go out and create your own thing you know um and that's the best moment to be entrepreneurial I'm not saying that there would be a form of job loss or reduction of jobs, but if there is, what a great moment to go out and create your own thing and to run your own, have equity in your own

thing. You know, I think that's one of the beauties of America, the United States, and you know, of a capitalist society is that anyone can go and create a thing and get venture capital money and go build a unicorn, but you got to go from passive to active and hit the [ __ ] it button, you know, because otherwise >> Yeah, definitely. For sure. That is a very great way to sum it up. Just moving from passive to active without overthinking too much and just like create and create some art as well. And eventually people are going to appreciate too.

>> Tyler, it is so lovely to have you on. Thank you so much for coming again to share your very inspiring journey. This is behind the founders with Carmen Dovad and Tyler Ridi. Be sure to stay tuned for the next